Cori (00:00):
Welcome to the Redefining Strength Podcast. Everything you need to succeed on your health and fitness journey. Even the stuff you don't want to hear. Stress. It's not just something we feel mentally, it's something we can feel physically. And while this might not be the first thing that often comes to mind when we're talking about stress, it can really have an impact on our gut, and our gut can really impact our stress levels. That's why I'm super excited to dive in today with Michelle to talk about that brain gut connection and stress specifically. So, hi Michelle. How are you doing?

Michelle (00:36):
I am doing well. Thank you for having me today.

Cori (00:38):
So let's talk about the gut and stress.

Michelle (00:46):
So as you said, they are greatly connected. It's kind of a two-way highway. The system and signals are going in both directions. That's why oftentimes it's referred to as the gut brain access or sometimes it'll even hurt, refer to as the gut being the second brain. So really what happens is whenever your stress hits, it does kind of flip you into the fight or flight mode. And when this happens, it can greatly impact you physically. Blood flow starts to shift away from your digestion and your stomach. So basically you kind of put your stomach and digestion on pause. This is where oftentimes you have indigestion, constipation, diarrhea, bloating and cravings that you didn't ask for. And usually when you're already stressed, it's not really the best time to be dealing with all this either.

Cori (01:33):
It's interesting to think about because we do think about stress is something mental that we feel and we know there are even physical things that happen. I know I get a little antsy when I'm sitting or I get food cravings. We think about emotional eating or we think about the fact that our heart rate goes up and we are breathing a little bit faster and we have to slow down our breathing, but we don't really think about how much digestion is truly impacted by this other than potentially that emotional eating. And I think it's such an interesting thing because it really is always that two-way street. So if our stress is impacting our gut, how then can we impact our gut to impact our stress?

Michelle (02:14):
Exactly. And there's a lot of ways that you can do that, right? There's a lot of tips and things that we'll even cover today that can help you even control that. But one of the things that I'm going to touch on is oftentimes when you're in that mode, you get tunnel vision. So usually when you have higher stress, it makes it harder to make better choices when it comes to your diet. And a lot of this has to do with, and we're humans. When we get in a situation where we have high stress moments or less time, we go to our default, we go to how we used to always function or what used to be our coping skills. And oftentimes those coping skills really aren't going to make things better, especially if it causes you to have poor food choices. So it's something that I always feel like we really need to kind of dive in how you're going to have to do it when it's hard, but the more action you take, it kind of compounds. So if you start to kind of focus and you make a little bit better health through your food choices during this time when stress is high, it's going to make it easier because all of a sudden you're going to have greater impact on your stress, but you have to recognize it. And I think that's the first step is recognizing when you're here, you're going to have to go through the hard and your perceived effort at this time is going to fill a lot greater.

Cori (03:34):
That truly is so key because we do go to that immediate gratification, that thing that's always fixed. The stress in the past in the moment, which ultimately often adds to our stress later on, makes us not feel so good, repeats the pattern, but in the moment it's really hard sometimes to catch ourselves, which is where I think this discussion right now is so important. And even this reflection prior is so important because it's one of these things we're going to kind of trust. How do we navigate, how do we manage it? And by planning ahead and considering that we can really set ourselves up for success and planning ahead doesn't mean saying, I'm not going to eat this thing at this time because that's probably the worst thing we could do, which only creates more of a guilt, more warring when we're actually stressed. But instead, how can I shift my actual environment to set me up to not repeat this pattern? I don't think we considered that enough. How can I set myself up so that this isn't something that adds to my stress at the time and I've slightly made it more conscious. The pattern I want to repeat because I can't repeat it just as easily.

Michelle (04:39):
I love that because one of the issues was when we have high stress levels is you do get decision paralysis. So if you've already pre-planned what those decisions are, then you're not going to be kind of stuck in the moment where you kind of freeze. And again, you kind of go back to those previous coping mechanisms if you know, have the conversation now or do that reflection now where you can kind of think through where are those scenarios that I tend to have high stress? What do I tend to do when I'm high stress? Is that when I tend to hit the drive-throughs more? Is that when I tend to do less cooking or so what am I going to do to make that plan B better and be able to have that decision? Now, this is oftentimes where I'll even say, yeah, have some shortcut meals that are quick, easy, fast, that you have it you can pull together from your pantry or your freezer. So when you're in those moments, you already know what to do because you've already preplanned that decision.

Cori (05:38):
You make the decision you truly want to make easier to make, and you make the decision you don't want to make. Or that even is an unconscious pattern you've defaulted into because in a time stress that's what we do. You made that harder. And I was thinking of an example where there's been a few times recently where I've been working on really intensive projects and at home I've had that tendency to want to go to the kitchen because it's really easy. And I'm also sort of thinking, so I am very move around as I'm thinking or doing stuff. I look like I'm pacing around a mad woman sometimes, but I'll use it even as an excuse then to go to the kitchen. I'm pacing back and forth, and then I'll end up by the cabinet. I'm then eating out of stress as I'm thinking about something.

(06:18):
And so I've found that even by changing my environment and working more from the gym on those days where I don't necessarily have those snacks around, only the things I brought, I'm not going to then take that extra effort to go out and get something even to DoorDash, something that will come to mind because it's not a pattern. I've been great in the past. And so for me, that will help me then stay focused. I then even do other behaviors where I'm like, okay, I'm a little bit stressed, so I'm going to even type and walk on the treadmill or do this or that. But it's shifting that environment to make those habits you want to be conscious of and stop doing easier to avoid while making the habits you want to do easier to do because you do have to fall back into what is natural to you or what is easiest to, or even an unconscious pattern. And the only way to break those things is to make them more conscious, which means doing the reflection before you're even stressed to be prepared for it versus trying to wipe up your way through, which only makes things worse.

Michelle (07:14):
Yes, exactly. It's sitting the time when you're not in that moment to put together a plan. And I think that's so key. Whenever we're dealing with the stress and when we're talking about gut health, you can't talk about gut health without talking about how stress and menopause and those things actually affect it.

Cori (07:33):
And then it's even that reflection, right? Reflecting on how those things impacted it, how you even handled the situation that you want it to handle. And in that reflection, that's where we can make some more changes, adding in better foods for our gut or even adjusting the environment further or doing those minimums. But the key is with that reflection also, not making ourselves feel guilty for it while owning all the other things that are going around and the impact they have.

Michelle (07:58):
Yes. Yeah, it's really making sure that you are taking ownership and truly controlling what you can control. And this is a scenario where a lot of times I'll hear like, oh, my gut health is just, I really struggle with it. But that control or that ownership of like, okay, well what are we actually doing to combat that? And if you are someone that tends to have major digestion issues, and usually for a lot of women too, this is a newer thing that they're dealing with. A lot of times women when they hit menopause, they all of a sudden start to find that they're struggling a little bit more with constipation, with bloating, with some of these gut issues. And it is linked back to you have estrogen and progesterone that are declining, and this affects your neurotransmitters like your serotonin and your gaba, that both are deeply tied to your mood and being able to stay calm.

(08:53):
So those hormonal shifts also are going to change your digestion. You're going to have slower motility. You are going to experience some increased bloating and even a shift in your microbiome itself. So you may feel more anxious, you may feel like you have more mental fog that you're carrying around and may feel like you're a little bit more indecisive. So again, if you're at this phase and you're like, that's me, I'm experiencing some of that, I feel some of that right now we want to take a little bit more direct approach when it comes to your diet to actually be able to give it what it actually needs to work within the system. So we can kind of off balance this.

Cori (09:35):
I think it's so key to really go into that more with the menopause and the hormonal shifts we're seeing because I'm a big control freak, and I always talk about controlling what you can control, taking ownership of everything because even though you can't control the rain, no, you can't control hormonal changes. You can have an impact on how they're expressed. And even realizing that our anxiety levels, our stress levels, we can't fully control those or stop what we get stressed about. However, we can then assess how we can alleviate that stress and even where it might be coming from that maybe we're not doing the most we can to optimize how our body is functioning. Because yes, while menopause can change our anxiety levels, it can impact our mood, it can impact brain fog, it can impact our gut health. We can then have an impact on those things to help potentially alleviate some of the other symptoms we're seeing instead of just writing them off. So I'd love to dive in a little bit more about some of the changes you're going to see in your gut and what we can really do to control those to then have it impact the other way since we've talked a little bit about trying to address that stress and the eating that can come out of that.

Michelle (10:39):
Yeah, so one of the first things is when you are more stressed or obviously we just talked about menopause, when you have that menopause shift, one of the first things that's going to change is your actual motility. So the capability of to be able to evacuate food from start to finish

Cori (10:58):
Is going, you say, so properly, your ability to poop, poop be

Michelle (11:01):
Efficiently. There you go.

(11:03):
Yes, you may find your struggling now, and this is one of the things that we often discuss, and I think the first thing that people think when they're having these issues is like, oh, I need a supplement. I need to add this supplement here. I need to add this. And really it's about knowing you need to get back to the basics, kind of like what you talked about earlier. Are you actually owning where current levels are at and are we truly doing everything there before we look at a supplementation? So I always will hear women that are like, oh yeah, I've started my fiber supplement and it's not necessarily always going to be a negative thing, but I often really have to challenge them because one of the things that I want them to look at is how much is their fiber supplement actually adding?

(11:47):
I can't tell you how many times people are like, oh, no fiber's good. I have my fiber supplement. And I'm like, yeah, that fiber supplement is typically only adding three to five grams and your RDA for women is 25. So we're really a drop in the bucket. And you still have to make those adjustments to your actual diet to be able to hit those. And I know fiber kind of seems like a very generic like, oh yeah, we know if you're having some issues, you should probably be looking at your fiber intake. But I even want to give a little bit background as to why fiber is so important. Not only are we going to help improve your ability to poop regularly, but we're also going to be feeding your good gut bacteria because there's different types of fibers. So what we're really looking at is we're fueling your gut lining.

(12:37):
We're keeping it strong, we're allowing it to be less leaky and being able to be better at defending you from it improves your immune health, but it's really because your gut bacteria ferments into fibers that actually break down into short chain fatty acids. And these are, we call them S CFAs, and these are some things that are so key for your health. So it's going to fuel your gut lining, it's going to help lower your inflammation. It helps by kind having a calming response in the gut and also beyond. We've talked about how you have neurotransmitters that are going back and forth up to your brain, these short chain fatty acids that are produced also will be communicating with your brain to be like, all right, we're doing well. It is going to support overall brain health and this can actually cross into your circulation and directly impact your, your food, your mood, and your focus and your stress regulation.

(13:36):
So this is really a huge part of that gut brain connector is actually fiber itself. So we're also going to be feeding the good guys. You probably have heard about, I mean it's so popular now to talk about gut bacteria and gut microbiome, but the fiber is really the key thing here. So we really want to make sure that we're having a diverse of variety of fiber that we are bringing in so that we can do all these things. So before you run out and it's like, oh yeah, I need to add that fiber supplement, let's actually look at what you were adding to your diet to hit there. First. A few of my favorites is I love adding cocoa powder to protein shakes, to your smoothies, to your oat oatmeal just because your cocoa powder I think is delicious. It has micronutrients in it as well, but two tablespoons is going to provide you four grams. So oftentimes you're going to be hitting more grams of fiber by adding cocoa powder than you are from your fiber supplements. And I'll be honest, I'm not a huge fan of the gummy fiber supplements just because I mean, they can be helpful, but typically when you're looking at the cost and benefit just calorie wise, they're not super worth it because usually they're super high in sugar and glucose and they're yummy, don't get me wrong, but we can usually do better just focusing on diet alone.

Cori (15:00):
And I love that you mentioned how important it's to get these things from whole natural foods because so often we talk about five or different things in isolation because we're going into the benefits of them specifically, but they don't operate in isolation when they come in the form of our foods, right? There are vitamins and minerals that a lot of times come with those high in fiber foods. There's also often healthy fats and all of these things have a huge impact on how our body and how our mind functions, especially when we're talking about what our body needs to create those neurotransmitters to function optimally. We need the vitamins of minerals. So if we're just going to a fiber supplement, we're missing a key component of what we're actually getting out of along the foods that also come with fiber. And the fiber helps us utilize those nutrients better.

(15:44):
So the more we can go to whole natural foods first, the better we're going to feel, the more fueled we're going to feel. And honestly, I know this sounds weird, but sometimes knowing you're even doing something good for your body can just alone improve your mood. And we feel a lot more successful potentially when we're saying, I'm getting all this range of stuff, or, oh, I'm just supplementing. I think there's an appreciation when you're putting in that little extra effort too, which then does help improve mood anxiety levels, all those different things. So super key besides fiber, which we're not all sold, we need more fiber, we're going to get through all natural foods. What other key things do we need to be including to keep our gut healthy?

Michelle (16:24):
So this is also looking at probiotic foods and fermented foods as well, because again, we're going to be looking at that live gut bacteria. And I say live because I think so often we think like, oh, you feed it and it just changes. No, you actually have bacteria that is multiplying in your gut, your GI tract. So we are trying to feed the good bacteria and we're basically trying to somewhat starve some of the bad bacteria, but I always imagine it as an inner war happening inside and we want to feed the good soldiers and we want them to outweigh the bad soldiers. So to do that, we really want to be paying attention to things that are going to be doing that well. And that is going to be things like your probiotics and your fermented foods. So this isn't just about only the live bacteria, but also the compounds that are actually created in fermentation.

(17:20):
So you do get organic acids and bioactive peptides that are going to come from these fermented foods and they're actually going to help benefit your bacteria to be able to thrive. So it's really about focusing, and it kind of goes back again to those short chain fatty acids. These probiotics and these fermented foods are going to help feed some of those short chain fatty acids. So that's kind going to be a big key. And I think so often every time we hear probiotics and fermented foods, our mind instantly goes to, alright, I need to get, again, I need to get this supplementation. I need to start eating kimchi and sauerkraut. If kimchi and sauerkraut are your jam, great. But there's other options out there that I think people need to just be aware of. Basically any product that's going to be fermented is going to be able to give you some of those benefits as well. So anything pickled, if you are a fan of pickles, if you're fan of pickled beets, if you're a fan of pickled red onions, those are great options. But one of my favorites is even getting people to recognize sourdough bread is actually a fermented product. So being able to add some of those themes are going to be key.

Cori (18:37):
I love that you brought that up. It was going to be a question if you didn't because while I'm a funky food person and I like my pickled things, my fermented fades, I know that often we hear fermented and people are instantly, how am I going to do that? But there are lots of ways to hit the nutrients that we need, and this is where if you really don't like a specific food and you're doing a lot of the other whole natural foods, we need to find our balance. So maybe you do include a supplement if it is something that you're even like, I'm not a fan of sourdough, but the more we can find those full natural sources, the better off we're going to be just because of how many things they include. Now off of this, I want to hit on one last major topic for gut health. And I think this is a really interesting one because it ties back to inflammation in our body, which is Kiwi address. If we are stressed, we don't realize how our body becomes inflamed with that stress if we're going through menopause and that's healthy fats. Can you tell us a little bit more about the impact that healthy fats have on our stress levels, on our gut health?

Michelle (19:37):
Yes. So one of the big things is making sure that we truly are having a healthy GI tract and making sure that we aren't doing anything that's going to compromise it. And you're going to do things. I'm going to tell you right now, on a daily basis, you are going to be doing things that are going to be compromising your gut health. And that's not just by potentially feeding it foods that aren't necessarily the best, but it is stress alone. And I don't know anyone that doesn't experience stress in some form or another or someone that doesn't get sick at some point that is going to affect your gut and your gut lining and your gut health. So we do want to be able to prepare it so that it can heal and make sure that we're making it strong as possible. So your gut lining is strong but flexible.

(20:24):
And our goal is to make sure that we keep that intact. So when we're looking at healthy fats specifically we're talking omega threes, you're going to get fatty acids like the EPA, the DHA from fatty fish. If you are plant-based, you're looking more at a LA and those are going to come from plant sources, but this is going to help reduce the inflammation that's going to occur in your gut lining. So this can protect against issues like leaky gut, IBS or inflammatory bowel disease, which sounds like super scary things, but it doesn't start there. It starts with inflammation within the GI lining. So being able to make sure that we are keeping that at bay and avoiding some of this chronic irritation that can happen over time, specifically if you do have higher stress, most of the time, if I have someone that talks to me about having any of these issues, it's pretty directly connected with stress.

(21:23):
Most of the time when they have flareups, it's because it's often during a high stress moment in their life. So we do want to make sure that we're providing things that if they're going to have chronic irritation, that we can improve the gut integrity. So that is going to be one of the big things is it's actually going to even lower some of the chances that your toxins, because this is the thing is I know we hear detox and all these things, but when you're eating, you're going to be adding some toxins. And when you're just while going through life, you're going to be facing some toxins. Your body is set up to be able to naturally detox. But a big part of that is actually your gut health. So to make sure that we are properly getting the toxins out, we want to make sure that we are providing our GI with what it needs to again, actually be able to stay strong and flexible. And this is also, I know I keep saying it, but I hope this actually shows how important this is, is it does actually help boost those short chain fatty productions as well. So we are going to pretty much everything when we're talking gut health and gut-brain access, it's going to come back to those short chain fatty acids like we are working to actually be able to help the body produce that more. So omega threes are going to be a big part of that.

Cori (22:46):
And I think tying this all together is one key thing I really want to highlight for people because we do talk about things as good or bad in isolation. We've heard cortisol demonized so much inflammation, demonize, stress demonize, and then we're talking about fiber being good and omega is being good. And it's not just these things in isolation because you actually need stress to get stronger, right? Working out is a stress on your body that creates that adaptation to grow stronger. However, it's managing those stress levels to be appropriate. That's key. And when you're creating that stress to actually have muscle growth, you're creating inflammation, but it's managing those inflammation levels so you recover, right? So it's not trying to avoid stress because we need the stress at times to change. We just want to manage that stress. We need inflammation to be caused, but we need to manage that inflammation.

(23:34):
So it's about getting the balance and understanding that it's not just these things in isolation and doing only good things and never doing bad things. We're not going to be able to avoid those. But it's how we navigate balance that ultimately really creates the best health for us, but also done in a way that we enjoy life because food has become a little bit more than just fuel. Not it's a tangent, but it has. So it's not about never necessarily getting to enjoy the foods you love, but it's being conscious of the balance you're creating so that then you can focus on these things for your gut health, especially if you are seeing changes with menopause or you are going through a more stressful time of life.

Michelle (24:12):
I love that. I mean, you're a hundred percent right. I think whenever we get in these conversations, I do think people hear kind of the absolutes, the all or nothing, but that's not how it is. It's really about finding the balance. We are, again, you're never going to live in a stress-free world. It's making sure that you are providing your body with the tools that when it does need to help combat a higher stress period for you that it's able to do that in a healthy and safe way.

Cori (24:39):
And with all this, right, we think, okay, so I want to be conscious of all these different things, but it's easier said than done. How can we be more mindful during a time potentially, and I know we talked a little bit about playing ahead, but during a time where we're often less mindful and more reactive, how can we pay attention to things that will promote better gut health and therefore ultimately help our stress levels?

Michelle (25:02):
So one of the things that is probably the easiest as far as it doesn't actually require you to be focusing on adding anything or really changing anything major other than just slowing down, but is actually the first thing that I see go out the window when anyone has higher stress or has a very busy schedule, is actually eating mindfully. And I know that seems so simple, but when you are in a rush state, there's actually research that shows when you are in a rush state of eating, you do not digest the same as if when you were in a calmer state. So how do we implement this when you are a little bit higher stress? One is actually making sure that you are maybe in a situation where you can eat a little bit more mindfully. We are very guilty of eating in the car, eating at our desk, doing those things.

(25:54):
And to be honest, even if you're doing that, because truthfully, I think sometimes that's unrealistic too, to be like, yeah, don't eat at your desk. Well, I have to get this huge project done so that I don't really have time to leave my desk. Then it's implementing some skills while you're eating so that you can make sure that you are not just eating too quickly and not actually paying attention to what's going in. So one of some key things there when you're in a higher stress is just the simple act of putting your fork down between bites. This is going to be something that slows you down just a little bit. It does actually improve digestion, and you're going to find that you're actually be digest, you eat mindfully and chew the fork just going in and in and in. When you set it down, it actually gives you some time to chew.

(26:48):
And when you're doing this, it actually activates the parasympathetic nervous system rest and digest. So this actually helps signal your body to ramp up digestive enzymes and stomach acids, so nutrients actually get broken down and absorbed. So if you're ever that person that you're like, oh man, why do I have indigestion after I ate fast? It's probably because your body wasn't able to signal quick enough that you needed more digestive enzymes to be set. So it's something that we really want to make sure that we are kind of slowing down just a little bit during those mealtimes because you are going to have less loading, better absorption of your nutrients when you're chewing more thoroughly. Chewing itself also helps signify to let's send some more digestive enzymes, and this is going to help even support some of your gut bacteria. So when food is properly broken down a little bit more thoroughly chewed, it provides the right predigested fuel for your microbiome to actually thrive.

Cori (27:48):
It's so interesting talking about some of these things and when you start to even reflect on what do I do? And so in hearing that, I started thinking about, okay, so a powder, we stress eat, go to the cabinet, you grab something, we're eating it all the way back. If you even just think, okay, when I'm stressed I do this. If I have to get back to the table, back to my desk before I even eat it, that gives you a pause even. And so I know that's not eating more mindfully or slower, but it's also pausing where you just would sort of cram it in as you're walking back to be more conscious of what you're consuming and whether you even want to consume it. And I think about how I've sometimes forced myself to do that where I'll go get the snap of even nuts and all the way back start to eat them, and I start to be like, okay, I'm stressed.

(28:31):
I work these into my macros, but I'm going to wait till I get back to my desk and then I'm going to eat them as I work intentionally. But as I work, I have to only take a couple and then I do a work slow down. So I'm like, oh, that's really interesting. Okay, so I'm being a little bit more mindful of slowing myself down and doing these things, but it's the reflection of the pattern for repeating then how they can work within that. Because as you said, you might have to eat at your desk. I'm having still snack at my desk, but I'm making my natural tendency work in a way that I'm actually appreciating a little bit more. It helps me de-stress because I'm having that thing I enjoy, but I'm doing it in a way that I'm more mindful, which is now helping my gut.

(29:08):
So it's some of this reflection to see how can I work in some of these positives in a way that truly fit what I need, and I can also get some healthy fats and write if I'm snacking on the nuts or whatever else. But how can you create pauses for yourself or that time and space to assess what you really want? If you're consuming things because you need them, listen to your hunger cues and slow down too. So I love that because I think being more mindful in everything, even not just eating, just being more mindful in our response to these things, that's going to help reduce our stress. So see, everything's connected. It's not just the foods that come with more micronutrients than just the fiber. Everything we do has so many different payoffs when we really assess and reflect on what's needed to feel our most fabulous.

Michelle (29:54):
Yes, and I love that because I think so often, right? As a dietician, in an ideal world, the answer is plate your food, sit down, eat in a quiet environment. But let's be honest, most of us are workers, most of us, some of us are moms. And so those quiet environments where you have time to actually sit down can sometimes be far and few in between. And oftentimes, usually it's lunch that that's not happening. Maybe you're able to do that more consistently with dinner, but typically breakfast and lunch are those that are kind of out a little bit out of the window and a little less controlled in your control. So I love that you said that because I often even get people and want people to reframe it a little bit as like, this is a micro self-care moment. And the payoff, you may think you're saving time, but in reality, the payoff of doing this is truly going to be what saves you time and energy in the long run.

(30:49):
Because I mean, how many times, I can't tell you how many times in the past I've had coworkers that are like, I wasn't even able to eat lunch today, and their stress is clear up here, versus that coworker that's like, yeah, I had the same amount of stress, but yeah, I ate out at my desk, but I was able to actually have a meal. And that greatly reduces that stress and even the perceived level of stress that you can feel. So you're really doing this to actually make you more efficient and get things, I mean, as you said, everything's just connected. You just feel better in the long run. And when you feel better, you're going to be able to approach things with more mental clarity. You're going to have more focus. You're probably going to be more efficient in whatever project or whatever you're doing.

Cori (31:37):
And it's assessing all the different tips we've given to not add more stress onto yourself to try and feel like you have to do everything, but find the ones that really work for you. And I was thinking about this as you mentioned, the snacking and eating at our desk. I will sometimes, if I have two snaps I needed planning to eat at the same time, even though you came down on me for not having something at my desk at all times, I'll actually sometimes bring over one snack, but leave another snack if I'm at the gym, potentially up in the fridge or in my bag or somewhere else so that I have to get up and get it so that I don't eat it as mindlessly and actually pause to appreciate it and enjoy it a little bit more, which for me reduces my stress.

(32:14):
And again, I'm a pacer too. I can't sit still for very long, so it gives me the opportunity to even get up again, but I don't just hoover it and not pay attention. I eat more mindfully because I have to go get that second thing. So it's really about assessing how can I use these tips in a way that helps me reduce stress over trying to be perfect with doing everything right now, which will ultimately just add to your stress. And off of that, any thoughts, Michelle? But also any closing tips If someone's like, okay, I really want to take action on this today, but I am a little overwhelmed and stressed by all the options, what can I do that would be easiest?

Michelle (32:50):
So I would challenge because I think it's, like I said, I think it's the less effort or I think it's higher perceived effort, but as far as you need to go out and change anything or go out and purchase anything, you don't have to. So the very first thing I would say is try to eat more mindfully today that today's lunch, tonight's dinner. Try to actually focus a little bit more on the food that you're consuming. Try to put that fork down in between. That's probably the first step. And like I said, often the first thing that goes out the window, if I was kind of categorize it, I would say, let's start there. And then the next big thing is just trying to focus on a way to build up your fiber. I know I mentioned 25 grams, ideally, specifically for my menopause clients, I actually find that they do better at 30 to 35 grams of fiber, which I mean, if you're not tracking fiber, you're probably going to be surprised by how low it's, and I don't want you jumping into that in one day.

(33:50):
We want to do a slow build. So just focusing on one item that you can add, like an extra three to five grams of fiber to your day, that's where I'd want to start. So just small, simple changes that are going to help kind of build you up. So those would be the two major things that I would say. Let's start there before we start getting into like, alright, let's add extra omega threes. Let's try to get more probiotic and fermented foods added. That's where I would highly recommend most people to start. When we're looking at how can we reduce stress through the way we're eating and the foods that we're providing ourselves.

Cori (34:26):
I think that's so key. And for me, with the fiber thing, it's thinking in terms of colors. How many colors have I consumed today? Getting the sweet potatoes, getting some green veggies, getting the berries. How can I consume more colors over the day? And even making note of them and now even trying to change and then being like, Hmm, this is something else I have in my fridge, was a great way for me to start approaching that and getting in more micronutrients, but in a way that wasn't stressful and was actually a fun game and gave my attention somewhere to go in some way. So wanted to throw that out there as well. But thank you so much, Michelle. So many great tips so that we can improve our gut. Healths feel the most fabulous, really help reduce our stress and anxiety, but also navigate it and manage it and recognize the signs and signals that maybe we're not fueling correctly. So thank you again, Michelle. Well, thanks for having me.